Oct
06
2009
This is Not Good
Rob Bell’s theological trajectory is not good. Case in point, this article from the Boston Globe.
Here, for example, is Bell’s definition of an evangelical, completely devoid of any theological or historical meaning.
I embrace the term evangelical, if by that we mean a belief that we together can actually work for change in the world, caring for the environment, extending to the poor generosity and kindness, a hopeful outlook. That’s a beautiful sort of thing.
And here’s Bell’s take on the heart of Christianity:
At the heart of the Christian story is resurrection, the belief that this world is good, and that, as a follower of Jesus, a belief that God hasn’t abandoned the world, but is actively at work in the world. Even in the midst of what can look like despair and destruction there is a new creation present.
He gets two points for mentioning resurrection and minus ten points for not mentioning the resurrection, the resurrection of Jesus Christ for the justification of sinners (Rom. 4:25). I think Bell believes in the historical resurrection of Christ, but to tell the Boston Globe that the heart of Christianity is simply our belief that God can bring good out of evil is to sell the farm.
At one point the interviewer notices the Rob doesn’t talk about religion or even mention Jesus very much. To which Bell replies:
I think we have enough religious people who are going around trying to convert people. My guard is up when somebody is trying to convert me to their thing. Are you talking to me because you actually are interested in this subject, because you care about me as a human, or am I one more possible conversion that will make you feel good about your religiosity? I don’t have any embarrassment about my religion, and it’s not that I’m too cool, but I would hope that the Jesus message would come through, hopefully through a full humanity. If you have something to say, whether you’re religious or not, if it is truly Christian and Jesus-centered, then it will help and be interesting and compelling to people, regardless of their world view. But I’m not just interested in talking to Christians. I’m interested in what does it mean to be fully human.
This is just so confused and unhelpful. It is classic old-school liberalism: Jesus as the fullest flower of fair humanity. The emphasis on creation has swallowed up the biblical notion of redemption. The shocking, vibrant apostolic message centered on the life, death, resurrection, coming kingdom, and coming judgment of Jesus Christ has morphed in a banal, same-old-same-old message about actualizing our humanity.
Yes, there are hucksters for the “faith” trying to cajole people into the kingdom. But before we chide those interested in conversion, we should remember that when King Agrippa asked Paul if he was trying to persuade him to be a Christian, Paul said “I would to God that not only you but also all who hear me this day might become such as I am” (Acts 26:29). And this was after he talked openly–to secular people mind you–about repentance, the sufferings of Christ, and the resurrection of Jesus from the dead.
I want to think Rob’s theology is better than what comes across in print. But the fact is that I never hear him in an interview (nor elsewhere for that matter) give an explanation of the gospel or a summary of the heart of Christianity that sounds anything like what we read from Peter, Paul, or Jesus. Rob is trying to help people. I bet he’s a nice, sincere guy. I’m sure he faces demands and pressures that I can’t imagine. But he keeps getting the most important questions wrong, and his theology keeps getting worse and worse.
I don’t know how to say this without sounding really condescending, but we should pray that the Lord would give Rob a clearer sense of the gospel and a courage to share it with all the winsomeness, cultural relevance, forthrightness, and biblical fidelity that Paul displayed at the original Mars Hill in Acts 17. No matter the extremes he may have seen in some unhealthy backwards churches out there, there’s no excuse for so frequently and so painfully botching the basic plotline of the Bible and ignoring the most important contours of the faith. With Rob’s notoriety, he has no choice but to ignore most of what people say about him. But I hope that he is open to thoughtful criticism. Not from me, but from someone he trusts who can ask some hard questions prod him back to surer ground.
I wouldn’t bother to mention Bell except that his influence and his church are larger than life in my old hometown. Emergent Village may be a falling star, but Rob Bell still draws a crowd. Talk to most youth group kids in America and they’ve not heard of Brian McLaren; they’re not reading Joel Osteen; most of them (unfortunately in my opinion) are probably not reading John Piper, and they’re certainly reading Kevin DeYoung less than any of those other guys. But they know Rob Bell. He is reaching many people, especially the young.
But, as always, the question is: what is he reaching them with? Not with the good stuff of the good deposit I’m afraid (2 Timothy 1:8-14).
HT: Team Pyro
36 Comments
Excellent comments. I've been troubled by what I have encountered of Rob Bell for a long time now. However, I'm sure you will receive your share of comments saying you are being unfair to him, and that the quotes cited were mangled by the paper's editors. I figure if that is the case Rob Bell should make it completely clear on that.
Rob Bell's silence – re:clarifying his words in that Boston globe interview – is deafening. Will he come out and say publicly that he was misquoted, or that his words in that piece don't reflect his actual views? Doubtful. And that's a shame. Even more of a shame? His books and his videos are being voraciously consumed in just about every church that I know of, and they don't seem to know the theology that is underpinning it all, and how scary it is, and where it is leading them, their children, and their churches. Pray for him, and these churches, indeed.
How crazy is it that it seems Rob is trying to avoid talking about God in the interview.
Put Driscoll in that same interview and you couldn't get out of the first answer without mention Christ at least three times and the gospel at least once.
We know Rob has the biblical foundation. All we can do is pray.
Thanks for this. I stand in agreement with you on the 'someone' being a person he trusts in order to 'prod him back to surer ground'; however, my initial fear is that such a person may not exist. I say that because his mentors tend to argue along similar lines and/or endorse what Bell has to say; thus, they may not see a need to prod him. So, in this case, I think, like you, that prayer is going to be best approach.
Rob Bell is a devil.
Kevin – I wholeheartedly agree with your exhortation concerning Rob Bell. Certainly, his popularity among believers and unbelievers alike holds him in line with the "teachers" James speak about in chapter 3, verse 1, stating that such will incur a stricter judgment. Hence, we do need to diligently pray for Bell's understanding of the glorious gospel and his bold declaration of it unapologetically.
I fully agree with your comments, Mr. DeYoung. I first heard about this interview a few days ago, and a pastor I sat in on this weekend talked about Rob Bell in much the same way you have in this post. In fact, he then showed your book, so I assume that he's very much in line with what you think.
I don't want to sound all apocalyptic or anything, but this sounds like a guy reaching those with itching ears to me. And that's not good.
Here's what I pointed out to people on my post about this last Friday (10/2):
1) Are you not amazed at how convoluted most of Rob’s answers are?
2) What do you make of the fact that he doesn’t seem to be about the task of converting people to faith in Christ?
3) And how about his view of God’s sovereignty (which there doesn't seem to be one in the classical sense)?
Your posts are so refreshing Kevin. They are so spot-on that I'm having my elders read them (well, as much as I can, anyway!)
http://clayjarspeaking.wordpress.com/2009/10/02/rob-bell-in-the-boston-globe/
Keep it comin. thanks for the honest and sincere tone here…
I live in Grand Rapids, and have been having problems with Mr. Bell and the whole emergent thing for a while.
I think that maybe it's time to focus back on truth and stop complaining about the "Bride of Christ" unless you have some answers to go with the complaints.
Peace and Pecans
Unfortunately, this post is needed. What Bell continues to espouse is dangerous. He does so with much influence.
Thanks for this post. Theology matters.
Dan is so kind trying not to sound "too apocalyptic." However, Dan's hunch is correct. Bell and others like him are precisely who God is talking about when He warns that in "those days" people will not stand for sound doctrine. These folks may be well-meaning, but they are dangerously heretical. These folks have perverted the God of the Bible and recreated Him in their own image. This is idolatry and blasphemy.
I know that I run the risk of being branded a mean-spirited, backward thinking fundamentalist, but it is high time that we quit bowing down to the spirit of the day and earnestly contend for the faith.
Kevin,
I usually enjoy your blog. This post irritates me, because I don't think you're giving Rob a fair shake.
You've launched a very weighty and substantive assault on him, which is all well and good — but to do it as the result of an article in the Boston Globe? Seriously?
If you're going to critique his theology, that's great. But at least critque something other than a Q&A with a reporter. Tackle one of his books. A sermon series. Something that Rob actually planned, developed, and then articulated.
Don't write the guy off based on an interview. That seems irresponsible.
brgulker,
I think Kevin was just commenting on Bell's interview because it was recent and it illustrates a deterioration from previously held positions. "Why We're Not Emergent" covers his books much more extensively.
brgulker,
If the interview were the only thing Kevin had to go on it would be bad enough concerning Rob Bell.
Based on his definition of evangelical I would say it's wise to write him off.
Beyond that, Bell has put out plenty of heresy over the years sufficient to condemn his as a heretic.
brgulker,
Did you read the first line of the post? Go back an ddo that [I'm waiting].
OK, now add to it that Kevin is most certainly aware of the sermons and writings of Rob Bell (He has written a book about the Emergent Church and did quote from Bell in it if I remember right).
If this was the first and only thing Bell had said that was pointing this way, you may be right. But, be honest, it is not.
Contrast how another pastor that is famously of the emerg*** stream, and with a church in Seattle might have answered this same question. One trajectory is completly the opposite of teh other!
To be honest, I don't know this guy, but as you stated, "This is just so confused and unhelpful. It is classic old-school liberalism: Jesus as the fullest flower of fair humanity."
I think everyday Michael Horton's book, Christless Christianity, is ringing ever more true. This stuff isn't coming from Liberals, it's coming from us.
Thanks for your interaction with the Globe interview. I was pleased to hear the gospel clearly defined and defended Sunday morning (listen here: http://www.universityreformedchurch.org/teaching/sermons.html?sermon_id=185), all the more poignant after just having read the Bell interview saturday (thanks to Adam Barr's post), shaking my head.
I don't think that you need to be too concerned about sounding condescending when you say that we need to pray for Bell that he would receive a clearer understanding of the gospel. Indeed, that is exactly what we should do, because through prayer God can change the heart of His people. Maybe that is exactly what Bell needs, especially if sound biblical advice of teachers who have offered him their take on his theology has fallen on deaf ears. Maybe that is how we should pray also, that God would open Bell's ears that he would hear the wisdom of the gospel and understanding of where his theology fails
To the board: Guys I attend Mars Hill and know Rob enough to say you've got it wrong. What you're looking for are formulaic statements supporting your belief system. He's not going to give you that satisfaction. His view of evangelicalism is that it has become more of a religion than a living faith. Stop throwing bricks at the brethren and grow up. Your showing your unloving side and it is sinful. Ps.. strive to be emerging Christians but not emergent Christians… perhaps that will help you get around some of your hangups… Since toning down his rhetoric a year ago Rob has been spot on across the board. Time for you guys to get with it as well. I'm not saying you have to agree but you need to better relate your faith to a dying, sinful world. Piper, Chandler, Driscol, all fine, but Rob is not the enemy here as much as we are when we feel that our "religion" is being threatened. If you look for stuff (in anybody, not just you're top-10 hit list) you'll find it… I don't think anyone on this board would do so well for the scrutiny each of you put Rob through as your brother in Christ. "Pluck out the planks in your own eyes" says Jesus; and, with the harlot that the Pharisees dragged in before Jesus he simply responded by drawing out their sins in his accusers lives as they one by one departed. If this board can only say what I have read above than its time to get off the board, be quiet or shut it down. I wouldn't think God is pleased with your critical spirit. Thank God young people are coming to Jesus… now let's get on with it and bring more in and start discipling and mentoring… but this kind of mentoring isn't helpful.
Bell is a kook.
Skinhead,
That is rich! You accuse the people of this board of being judgmental by being judgmental.
Smell the irony!
Your emotion filled diatribe smells like 'youthful lust'. It is ok that people do not like Rob Bell, if you believe that he is doing great work, don't be so threatened by criticism of him.
PS It would help if you made a profile avaialble so that we could all see who you are. People who are not able to stand up for their words are not very credible.
PPS Please study more on the Pharisees. It gets wearying in that every conversation on the Emergen*** church the 'Pharisee card' gets played to shut down discussion. It is like in the secular world that words like 'racism' and 'Hitler' are used to shut down conversation.
Bell just tweeted the gospel ( http://twitter.com/realrobbell/status/4631728631):
"The gospel is the counterintuitive, joyous, exuberant news that Jesus has brought the unending, limitless, stunning love of God to even us."
…by offering us free, giant Twinkies.
Lest we forget that great theolog Paul…
1 If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. 2 And if I have prophetic powers, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. 3 If I give away all I have, and if I deliver up my body to be burned, but have not love, I gain nothing…. 8 Love never ends. As for prophecies, they will pass away; as for tongues, they will cease; as for knowledge, it will pass away…. 1 Cor 13
Have a twinkie guys and this time remember to read it… "The gospel is the counterintuitive, joyous, exuberant news that Jesus has brought the unending, limitless, stunning love of God to even us…. (even to you who dare to eat God's word)."
Love wins if Jesus wins first and Jesus doesn't win if love isn't present… be ye lights to a darken world… join together as children of God… for the enemy seeks to devour you….
peace my friends
What does this mean?
'Love wins if Jesus wins first and Jesus doesn't win if love isn't present'
Help me out. Where is that ever described as the Gospel. That is not Romans 5, that is not 2 Cor. 5:21, that is not Isaiah 53.
The above statement sounds like a Hallmark card. I reccomend that you study what the Gospel actually means before you end up preaching 'another Gospel' as warned against in Galatians.
"I think that maybe it's time to focus back on truth and stop complaining about the "Bride of Christ" unless you have some answers to go with the complaints."
I think the critiquing Rob Bell is pretty far from complaining about the Bride of Christ.
About as far as complaining about the lady down the street is attacking my wife.
At some point confusion becomes deliberate and error becomes damnable heresy.
I've tried to see the Rob Bell hasn't crossed that line, but everytime I look, there he is, on the other side. Not evangelizing, but setting up a home office.
I am afraid that any form of "compassion" that is not centered on the atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ is superficial and ultimately doomed to failure because it does not take into account man's basic problem. World Magazine quoted an atheist from England who wrote in the London times,"As an atheist, I truly believe Africa needs God. Missionaries, not aid money, are the solution to Africa's biggest problem." He has come to the surprising conclusion that the greatest contribution missionaries bring to that continent is the message of Christ — evangelism. He says, "Christianity changes people's hearts. It brings a spiritual transformation. The rebirth is real. The change is good." As Christians, we know that conversion — genuine faith and repentence — is the only way back to being "fully human." But apparently we need to spend more time understanding why that is and carefully communicate it to our families and in our spheres of influence.
A very thoughtful and kind examination of a childish person who fancies himself a Christian spokesman.
I think Bell's main problem is that he just needs to communicate his thoughts better. Yes, he should have inserted the word "the" before resurrection, but anyone not looking for every slight mistake in his speech would've understood he meant "the resurrection". I also believe what Rob said (Kevin's paraphrase – "God can bring good out of evil") was close to the description of the heart of Christianity, he just needed to elaborate more (better communication). What could've been added is the fact that Christ came to free us from the slavery of sin, of the desires of the flesh, thus giving us hope, the ability to sincerely love others, and to share the Good News to everyone. Essentially that is bringing good out of evil. I would highly contest the statement that his theology keeps getting worse and worse. Can anyone show this to me? (I'm not asking this out of arrogance but rather out of curiosity, being in college I don't have time to read a large quantity of books or sermons, let alone his) "But, as always, the question is: what is he reaching them with? Not with the good stuff of the good deposit I'm afraid." My last point is that you can't label all of Bell's teachings as false or heretic because some of his beliefs are slightly off-center and not Scripture-based. (Though I certainly agree with praying for the correction of those beliefs!) He does say a lot of wise, helpful things. He does care about others and their well-being. He wants to give people hope by telling them about Jesus. "If you have something to say, whether you're religious or not, if it is truly Christian and Jesus-centered, then it will help and be interesting and compelling to people, regardless of their world view." By saying he believes this we can deduce that he does talk to people about Jesus, not just social justice or whatever you may get out of his sometimes confused dialogue. Thus, I believe there are multitudes of people worldwide that are receiving truth from Rob Bell. I also believe he is not their only source of truth, that they do read their Bibles and go to a different church, so they are getting a complete version of the Gospel. These Christians are not being hindered in their faith by listening or reading what Rob Bell says. How can I make this claim? I don't have proof except from my own life, but it seems very logical that he does have a positive spiritual impact on people. In fact I've watched a couple of his Nooma videos and took a few good notes. The spiritual information I receive form Rob Bell is no where near the total amount I receive in my day to day life but what he said hasn't degraded my spiritual life in anyway. So, for most of the people responding to this blog it wouldn't help their spiritual growth to read or listen to Rob Bell but for others it will.
I remember Justin Taylor posted a video a few weeks ago about, “Ignatius, the super youth pastor.” Rob Bell sounds like the non-satirical, real-life version of him. The proverbial wolf in sheep’s clothes.
[...] This is Not Good — a robust criticism of Rob Bell, one of the leaders in the Emergent church. [...]
It is debates/arguments/points of view like this that made me leave “the church” altogether.
Rob Bell speaks to a group of non-believers that the entire church up until now has been unable to reach. I was able to get some of my atheistic friends to read some of his books that spawned many, many questions. It’s an idea that our generation can completely wrap our minds around and join the Christian faith and delve deeper into what Christ wants for our lives.
Debating things like his wording or what his true intentions are, again, makes me glad that I left “the church.”
[...] Rob Bell’s theological trajectory isn’t getting better. (No Love Yet) Loading … [...]
Thanks foodfanatic and Juli M. Well said.
All I would like to add to this conversation is this:
I listened to audio from Mars Hill Bible Church today on Youtube called “Rob Bell defends his church” or something like that. I recommend listenig to it in it’s entirity to help gain some of his perpective. After you’ve done that, I’d like to make a suggestion. Rather than just praying that Bell will see the supposed error of hiw teachings and ways, and rather than hoping that someone close to him says what you want him to hear, why not contact him yourself? I’m sure he’s a busy guy, but a kindly worded email expressing your intentions might just garner a response, especially if the Lord is on your side in this debate.
Regardless of whether or not you get the response you’re looking for, we should all be able to agree that sounding off with harsh words in a blog and chat room is worlds away from what Jesus taught in Mt 18, and when Paul disagreed with Peter he confronted Peter in love BEFORE he wrote about it. Since most of you think Bell’s misguided, wrong, heretical, or even “from the devil” (the audacity of that judgment shocks me to the core), shouldn’t you be willing to do what we as ministers of Jesus Christ would do or any lost soul or wayward brother? I hope those of you who are willing to be so vocal in this arena will be open to some gentle suggestions from a brother who desires to see you do the right thing.
I apologize for the typos I’m sure are in this post. I’m writing from a phone. And so none of you think me to be hiding behind a shield of anonymity, you are welcome to tweet me @aaronk13.
I think Bell makes it clear here….listen to it then critique him.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIKkvmSNUCY