Comments on: Moldova Report http://thegospelcoalition.org/blogs/trevinwax/2008/10/02/moldova-report/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=moldova-report Kingdom People - Living on Earth as Citizens of Heaven Wed, 08 Feb 2012 22:07:17 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: paulsanduleac http://thegospelcoalition.org/blogs/trevinwax/2008/10/02/moldova-report/#comment-3119 paulsanduleac Sat, 11 Oct 2008 08:34:30 +0000 http://trevinwax.wordpress.com/?p=1934#comment-3119 I like your post. It's a great encouragement Thanks I like your post. It’s a great encouragement
Thanks

]]> By: TOTUL PRIN HAR http://thegospelcoalition.org/blogs/trevinwax/2008/10/02/moldova-report/#comment-3109 TOTUL PRIN HAR Mon, 06 Oct 2008 06:29:53 +0000 http://trevinwax.wordpress.com/?p=1934#comment-3109 C.N.Ilie- Let it be known that I'm not here to build a certain church... I'm here so that Christ will be exalted in people claiming to be Christians... I realize that the Protestant (Penticostal and Baptist) churches here have the same exact problems as does the Orthodox church... That problem is LEGALISM... Believing that Christ plus works equals salvation... The Apostle Paul called that kind of Doctrine foolish, regardless of what church you go to... He said let them be accursed who preach a different Gospel... I don't care if you call yourself Orthodox,Baptist Pentecostal or Presbyterian... If you rejoice in Christ alone, you are my brother!!! I do understand where a lot of the traditions came from in the Orthodox Church, but I do believe that the real meaning of them has been abused and forgotten in many of the churches... May God bless you with a joy in our Saviour C.N.Ilie- Let it be known that I’m not here to build a certain church… I’m here so that Christ will be exalted in people claiming to be Christians… I realize that the Protestant (Penticostal and Baptist) churches here have the same exact problems as does the Orthodox church… That problem is LEGALISM… Believing that Christ plus works equals salvation… The Apostle Paul called that kind of Doctrine foolish, regardless of what church you go to… He said let them be accursed who preach a different Gospel… I don’t care if you call yourself Orthodox,Baptist Pentecostal or Presbyterian… If you rejoice in Christ alone, you are my brother!!!

I do understand where a lot of the traditions came from in the Orthodox Church, but I do believe that the real meaning of them has been abused and forgotten in many of the churches…

May God bless you with a joy in our Saviour

]]> By: C.N. Ille http://thegospelcoalition.org/blogs/trevinwax/2008/10/02/moldova-report/#comment-3108 C.N. Ille Mon, 06 Oct 2008 04:20:19 +0000 http://trevinwax.wordpress.com/?p=1934#comment-3108 I see, every "part of the country" that has fewer Protestant conventicles (adunari pocaiesti) is dead!!! You are "there" to proselytize and spread YOUR version of what you call the "Gospel". Other "pocaiti" will try to spread theirs. Yet, in every village that has an Orthodox church, as all villages and towns of Romania are, the holy Gospel is intoned and proclaim at every Matins (utrenia) and Liturgy, on every Sunday and feast day, which are very numerous. Count then the baptisms and funerals. All these offices have plenty of readings from the Holy Gospels themselves, without any personal interpretation of the priest's. All the offices (slujbele) of the Orthodox Church are full of Scripture readings, Scripture hints and they speak themselves the language of the Divine Scriptures. What our folks don't know- and what you mis-identify as "the Gospel" are those very specific Protestant mantras and the very specific Protestant language of personal saviors, decisions etc. I see, every “part of the country” that has fewer Protestant conventicles (adunari pocaiesti) is dead!!!
You are “there” to proselytize and spread YOUR version of what you call the “Gospel”.
Other “pocaiti” will try to spread theirs.
Yet, in every village that has an Orthodox church, as all villages and towns of Romania are, the holy Gospel is intoned and proclaim at every Matins (utrenia) and Liturgy, on every Sunday and feast day, which are very numerous. Count then the baptisms and funerals. All these offices have plenty of readings from the Holy Gospels themselves, without any personal interpretation of the priest’s.
All the offices (slujbele) of the Orthodox Church are full of Scripture readings, Scripture hints and they speak themselves the language of the Divine Scriptures.
What our folks don’t know- and what you mis-identify as “the Gospel” are those very specific Protestant mantras and the very specific Protestant language of personal saviors, decisions etc.

]]> By: TOTUL PRIN HAR http://thegospelcoalition.org/blogs/trevinwax/2008/10/02/moldova-report/#comment-3110 TOTUL PRIN HAR Sun, 05 Oct 2008 19:09:44 +0000 http://trevinwax.wordpress.com/?p=1934#comment-3110 Hello there... I've been a missionary in Romania for 12 years serving in a very dead part of the country (Oltenia). Here everyone is "Orthodox" but have no faith in the gospel... They have faith in everything but the fact that Jesus' blood is the answer... I believe that's why we are here. To awaken a sleeping "Christian" people... It is the Gospel that saves, sanctifies and causes us to enjoy God... Yes there are many American "Christians" who are very far away from the truth as well... I don't deny that. Christians should be people that rejoice in Jesus. Honestly I don't meet too many people here who do that... So few know anything about Jesus... I guess that happens when you don't believe the Bible is the inspired word of God. Trevin, where were/are you serving? I'm in Ramnicu Valcea. We've got a blog as well in Romanian and English if you want to check it out. http://bisericabetesda.wordpress.com http://itsallbygrace.wordpress.com Domnul sa va binecuvanteze!!! Hello there… I’ve been a missionary in Romania for 12 years serving in a very dead part of the country (Oltenia). Here everyone is “Orthodox” but have no faith in the gospel… They have faith in everything but the fact that Jesus’ blood is the answer… I believe that’s why we are here. To awaken a sleeping “Christian” people… It is the Gospel that saves, sanctifies and causes us to enjoy God… Yes there are many American “Christians” who are very far away from the truth as well… I don’t deny that. Christians should be people that rejoice in Jesus. Honestly I don’t meet too many people here who do that… So few know anything about Jesus… I guess that happens when you don’t believe the Bible is the inspired word of God.

Trevin, where were/are you serving? I’m in Ramnicu Valcea.

We’ve got a blog as well in Romanian and English if you want to check it out.
http://bisericabetesda.wordpress.com
http://itsallbygrace.wordpress.com

Domnul sa va binecuvanteze!!!

]]> By: C.N. Ille http://thegospelcoalition.org/blogs/trevinwax/2008/10/02/moldova-report/#comment-3118 C.N. Ille Sat, 04 Oct 2008 18:41:39 +0000 http://trevinwax.wordpress.com/?p=1934#comment-3118 Correction : "You quite say..." Correction :
“You quite say…”

]]> By: C.N. Ille http://thegospelcoalition.org/blogs/trevinwax/2008/10/02/moldova-report/#comment-3117 C.N. Ille Sat, 04 Oct 2008 18:40:11 +0000 http://trevinwax.wordpress.com/?p=1934#comment-3117 I quite say that your aim is to build 'evangelical churches" in as many villages as possible, yet you disown any attempt on your part to "destroy the OC". May I ask, whom do you build those churches for? For the Muslims of Moldova? For the Buddhists? I guess not, but for the local Orthodox Christians whom you try to convert to your version of Christianity (which, btw, differs, in several important issues with the Scriptures, the Fathers and the Ecumenical Councils). At least call a spade a spade. I quite say that your aim is to build ‘evangelical churches” in as many villages as possible, yet you disown any attempt on your part to “destroy the OC”. May I ask, whom do you build those churches for? For the Muslims of Moldova?
For the Buddhists?
I guess not, but for the local Orthodox Christians whom you try to convert to your version of Christianity (which, btw, differs, in several important issues with the Scriptures, the Fathers and the Ecumenical Councils).
At least call a spade a spade.

]]> By: Trevin Wax http://thegospelcoalition.org/blogs/trevinwax/2008/10/02/moldova-report/#comment-3116 Trevin Wax Sat, 04 Oct 2008 16:22:12 +0000 http://trevinwax.wordpress.com/?p=1934#comment-3116 C.N., Our efforts at evangelism are not an attempt to destroy the Orthodox Church. Most Eastern Europeans see Orthodoxy as a national identity. They would claim Christian faith, but many have little understanding of true Scriptural teaching and few know Christ personally. I believe the same problem exists in the United States - specifically in the South, in the Bible Belt, where almost everyone claims to be "Baptist." Though I am a Baptist, I do not believe that everyone who takes the moniker of "Baptist" in the South is truly a believer in Christ. For many, it is a cultural identity that goes no deeper. Again, the issue is not Eastern Orthodoxy itself (although as a Protestant, I do differ significantly with Eastern Christianity on several important issues). The issue is true belief versus false faith. I preach the same gospel in the South to "nominal Baptists" that I preach in Moldova to the nominally Orthodox: Repent and believe in the gospel. C.N.,

Our efforts at evangelism are not an attempt to destroy the Orthodox Church. Most Eastern Europeans see Orthodoxy as a national identity. They would claim Christian faith, but many have little understanding of true Scriptural teaching and few know Christ personally.

I believe the same problem exists in the United States – specifically in the South, in the Bible Belt, where almost everyone claims to be “Baptist.” Though I am a Baptist, I do not believe that everyone who takes the moniker of “Baptist” in the South is truly a believer in Christ. For many, it is a cultural identity that goes no deeper.

Again, the issue is not Eastern Orthodoxy itself (although as a Protestant, I do differ significantly with Eastern Christianity on several important issues). The issue is true belief versus false faith. I preach the same gospel in the South to “nominal Baptists” that I preach in Moldova to the nominally Orthodox: Repent and believe in the gospel.

]]> By: C.N. Ille http://thegospelcoalition.org/blogs/trevinwax/2008/10/02/moldova-report/#comment-3115 C.N. Ille Sat, 04 Oct 2008 16:00:13 +0000 http://trevinwax.wordpress.com/?p=1934#comment-3115 Why do the American Protestants feel the urge to spread their "good news" to Eastern Europe and to Eastern Christians, in general, as if they were some sort of "terrae missionis" or "partes infidelium"? I was reading the reports written by American Protestant missionaries of their efforts, during the 19th and early 20 th centuries, to spread their version of the Gospel to the Nestorians and other Eastern Churches. Such childish naivety and historical ignorance combined with Anglo-Saxon/White messianic fervor (the white man's burden)! The only things they were able to see in those Christians who still clung to their faith after so many centuries of far more hostile circumstances than the West has ever known, were-I quote_ "heartless worship" (as if they could measure that), "dead rituals" (not being aware that they were the innovators here, having done away with almost everything that could have been recognized as Christian liturgy, from a historical retrospective), "dead churches" (but their faithful's blood has continually been poured by one oppressor or another), "superstitious Christians" (that is, untouched yet by the Enlightenment) etc. It made me sick. Does this urge to "evangelize" other older Churches result from the Protestant's deep fear that they are cut off the historic Christianity? Is this a way of reassuring themselves that the reformation was right by spreading it to Christians untouched by it? I am an Eastern Christians, my family has been like that from times immemorial and quite happy with things as they are. Why do the American Protestants feel the urge to spread their “good news” to Eastern Europe and to Eastern Christians, in general, as if they were some sort of “terrae missionis” or “partes infidelium”?
I was reading the reports written by American Protestant missionaries of their efforts, during the 19th and early 20 th centuries, to spread their version of the Gospel to the Nestorians and other Eastern Churches. Such childish naivety and historical ignorance combined with Anglo-Saxon/White messianic fervor (the white man’s burden)!
The only things they were able to see in those Christians who still clung to their faith after so many centuries of far more hostile circumstances than the West has ever known, were-I quote_
“heartless worship” (as if they could measure that), “dead rituals” (not being aware that they were the innovators here, having done away with almost everything that could have been recognized as Christian liturgy, from a historical retrospective), “dead churches” (but their faithful’s blood has continually been poured by one oppressor or another), “superstitious Christians” (that is, untouched yet by the Enlightenment) etc. It made me sick.
Does this urge to “evangelize” other older Churches result from the Protestant’s deep fear that they are cut off the historic Christianity? Is this a way of reassuring themselves that the reformation was right by spreading it to Christians untouched by it?
I am an Eastern Christians, my family has been like that from times immemorial and quite happy with things as they are.

]]> By: In the Blogosphere « Kingdom People http://thegospelcoalition.org/blogs/trevinwax/2008/10/02/moldova-report/#comment-3114 In the Blogosphere « Kingdom People Fri, 03 Oct 2008 08:48:57 +0000 http://trevinwax.wordpress.com/?p=1934#comment-3114 [...] Top Post this Week at Kingdom People: Moldova Report [...] [...] Top Post this Week at Kingdom People: Moldova Report [...]

]]> By: Zach Nielsen http://thegospelcoalition.org/blogs/trevinwax/2008/10/02/moldova-report/#comment-3113 Zach Nielsen Thu, 02 Oct 2008 14:35:25 +0000 http://trevinwax.wordpress.com/?p=1934#comment-3113 Just over two years ago my wife spent 10 days in a Moldovan orphanage. It was a profoundly moving time for her. Thanks for sharing your experience there. Just over two years ago my wife spent 10 days in a Moldovan orphanage. It was a profoundly moving time for her. Thanks for sharing your experience there.

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